there are no marks anywhere except serial #xxx on bottom of barrel below base pin. how to tell Pedersoli from Pietta on 1858 Remington New Army, "You've got to do your own growing, no matter how tall your grandfather was. The action proof marks were under the action just behind the loading platform. We accomplished that with a Sharpie, and that helped our groups. The left side of the frame has Italian proof marks. The Old Model started production in 1861 with the slightly improved New Model Army coming out in 1863 . I have one 4 revolving barrel handgun, percussion, double action, looks like 36 caliber. Y'All take care now!! Copyright 2011-2023 All Rights Reserved. Nit mine but it is just like this one in the link below. Copyright 2023 Aceville Publications Ltd. On the top of the barrel, an inch in front of the rear sight, was PATENT. The order was signed J. We did not fire this pistol. i Have a black powder pistol with the star circle over PN with AC in a square next to it and the crossed rifles with the star circle over it and it has 2115 R a P over an R and FTE Italy on the butt. Recent Euroarms pistols have been observed with a new mark which looks like a letter N surrounded by four triangles. If you wish to send some photographs to the magazine I'm sure they will forward them to me and I may be able to help you more. I like the Uberti's use of discrete placement of proof marks. Aldo Uberti S.r.l. Englishmen are not CITIZENS, they are SUBJECTS! The technical storage or access is strictly necessary for the legitimate purpose of enabling the use of a specific service explicitly requested by the subscriber or user, or for the sole purpose of carrying out the transmission of a communication over an electronic communications network. 0000057983 00000 n Yes, that can be confusing, but we did like the 1860 Henry by the Italian maker better than we did the namesake brands gun. The magazine held 13 rounds, despite the manual saying it was 10. First Year of Production Navy Arms, 1851 Navy Revolver, Parts for Pierson Ruschetta (PF) 1851 Navy. [CDATA[*/var out = '',el = document.getElementsByTagName('span'),l = ['>','a','/','<',' 109',' 111',' 99',' 46',' 108',' 105',' 97',' 109',' 116',' 111',' 104',' 64',' 57',' 51',' 56',' 48',' 51',' 53',' 95',' 100',' 121',' 111',' 119','>','\"',' 109',' 111',' 99',' 46',' 108',' 105',' 97',' 109',' 116',' 111',' 104',' 64',' 57',' 51',' 56',' 48',' 51',' 53',' 95',' 100',' 121',' 111',' 119',':','o','t','l','i','a','m','\"','=','f','e','r','h','a ','<'],i = l.length,j = el.length;while (--i >= 0)out += unescape(l[i].replace(/^\s\s*/, '&#'));while (--j >= 0)if (el[j].getAttribute('data-eeEncEmail_RXYbuCMoMg'))el[j].innerHTML = out;/*]]>*/ I live, eat and breathe Black Powder revolvers, and enjoy comparing notes with other shooters! Its not as fast to reload as, say, a Winchester 1873, but it does hold lots of ammo. The Springfield Trapdoor Cartridge Rifle and Carbine was produced for the military in 1873. The most visible change is the change from a crown to a star 1950 so crown and PSF is from the time between 1923 and 1950. 0000028135 00000 n Delivery of item will be in 3 - 6 business days to Continental USA. <<9CAB7C9ADE9DBB4DB23FAD02FA255802>]>> 0000078548 00000 n Look on the revolver barrel or bottom or side of cylinder frame. 0000011024 00000 n .22 Long Rifle" is marked twice around the circumference of the cylinder at the rear along with two proof marks. There are no chips or cracks. Even has the same box. 0000006823 00000 n I have a.s.m.black powder only cal. Bore Condition:The bore is mostly bright with sharp rifling. A copy of a shipping manifest dated December 23, 1986 from Aldo Uberti & Co. to Colt Industries Firearms Division (Charter Oak Blvd, W. Hartford CT 06119 USA) detailing Italian Goods to be Exported. Thats not enough recommendation for us to invest in the Henry Original, so we began looking for a similarly styled levergun and found the Uberti version of 1860 Henry for a lot less money. OCT. 16. There were ultimately 5 variations of the Remington Rolling Block pistol culminating with the Model 1871. All of these reproductions will also be marked ITALY or MADE IN ITALY, along with a serial number, calibre and, in the case of Uberti and Pedersoli, often a catalogue number. Come join the discussion about performance, gunsmithing, troubleshooting, reviews, accessories, classifieds, and more! 0000000016 00000 n 0000011827 00000 n The screwheads have strong slots and remain serviceable. THE AMERICAN SPIRIT. Click Here to log in. 13) Were it not for the proof marks this Uberti could easily be passed off as an original Colt. 3l\9/OEK0joW/L242:ORES\";OhBzP%% - eupGHsP/Y$T y&$ iJ.iO7+asMi3>6fV#iBM u*wzY!.biCEy;Z7yA+lpNQFP+dV4N5t i Powered by Invision Community. C.-{.-~Q~vVW?[.aMF^fV?4J/:50fb0L@w6l=lMaCFnO,ta#ip:xCr3A?Z[Hi6? There were no other markings on the rifle. 0000052647 00000 n Thanks you in advance, Wayne, I am trying to identify the value of the black power gun,armi san marco, it has a # on barrel, You can contact Pietta at . It was a redesign of the Army's Allin Trapdoor rifle. 0000001537 00000 n Barrel is marked "Navy Arms Ridgefield NJ - Italy" and the upper tang is marked "CAL 22 LR". Other side says Palmer brescia Italy. The Remington ammo was balky on entering the chamber. To become a member $3 for one day $7 one month or $15 one year Click to join here. Prior to 1954 the year of proof was stamped on the guns in Arabic numerals, but this new coding system was introduced around the time of the first reproductions. This is not one of the standard Pedersoli or Pietta proof marks, nor is it a Uberti proof mark. In October 2016, I spotted another Uberti/Colt .44 Magnum on the Guns International web site (, No comments permitted but if you like Colt revolvers take a look. 0000039439 00000 n 0000002293 00000 n Thank you. I have a Uberti made .44 Mag. Overall Condition:The pistol retains about 95% of its metal finish. 0000001338 00000 n 3) Armi San Marco name stamp (1994) 4) The distinctive Uberti logo. 0000002052 00000 n The rifle did not seem to require a break-in period to deburr it, as had the other one. 12) Pedersoli sometimes stamp their name on the inside of the lock. This stands for Armi Chiappa in reference to Rino Chiappa, the companys founder. Where can I find them.Got a 22 cal I would like to find out about.1866,from Navy Arms no name or modle. 7) Mark on a recent Euroarms revolver. Top of the barrel says "wesson" right side, looking down range says .50 cal black powder only. Some proof marks on side of frame and the roman numeral XX. I take it that it was made in 1979, which sounds right, I bought it used in the early 1980's. It is a well made old gun. 0000012438 00000 n For all practical purposes, the import of Italian replica cartridge sixguns started in 1962. These codes go back to 1954, starting with Roman numeral, "X" (ten) and increasing by one each year so, 1955 = XI, 1956 = XII. 3) Armi San Marco name stamp (1994) 0000105711 00000 n The sights were identical to those found on the Henry Henry, the rear having all the same little cuts, holes, notch contours, elevation slide and markings as on the other rifle. A forum community dedicated to Colt firearm owners and enthusiasts. Next is the mark which has "PN" - the Gardone & Brescia 1st Black Powder Proof mark used since 1959. We found all the controls to be smooth, including the loading gate at the front of the rifle. Could it be possible proof marks and makers marks were filed off of it. The second proof mark is a similar star and circle, slightly larger, above the letters PN. I have a 62 cal, shield inlay, short stock, palm tree markings, liverpool on the side plate. Be advised there are some hot 45 LC loads, such as from Buffalo Bore, that probably ought not to be used in this rifle, certainly not as a steady diet. A PDF link to Dennis Adler's article about Italian Black Powder Proof marks is given below. There is no maker marks on this rifle at all.The proof marks say it is made in 1967.The links in it look like they could handle 44-40.I took it down all the way but pull the barrel off and no maker marks.I have had 4 Uberti 22s over the years and they all had Uberti on them somewhere.This is the smoothest of all of the ones I have had,but still don't know who made it.I had a lever safety or at least had a place for one.This is the only one that the forearm barrel band is brass and the sight band is brass. The bluing was authentic looking. Could it be one of those? Hb``a``=P @1630i`@GDTVs(R {g i 23>`.0,p?PA! 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In our October 2015 issue, we took a hard look at the Henry Repeating Arms Original Rifle in a test that included a Winchester 1892, both rifles in 44-40 WCF. The technical storage or access is required to create user profiles to send advertising, or to track the user on a website or across several websites for similar marketing purposes. 0000037734 00000 n My wife and grand kids and my kids. Unlike the other rifle, this one came with a comprehensive yet brief manual that told how to operate it all. In the early days of the Navy Arms / Uberti connection, Gregorelli actually produced the metal . Heres what we found. We again state its a good idea to have the rifle entirely empty when you load the rifle to avoid the possibility of a major blunder that could cost you a hand, or worse. by F.A.R.A; It appears to be a notch or two higher quality in fit & finish to the many such repros of this rifle I've seen over the yearsanyone have knowledge of the maker? Both use small lettered stamps Cirmarron tends to place the . They are the earliest Navy Arms made. Stamping on the frame is CMC or CMG also not clear. 0000006039 00000 n endstream endobj 43 0 obj <> endobj 44 0 obj <>stream Type of Finish:Blue, Case Color and Brass. 36 made in itlay. Two more Rifle models come in the same chamberings (342370 in 44-40 and 342360 in 45 Colt) and have the same barrel lengths as the brass ones, but they display case-hardened frames and levers and blued buttplates and list for $30 more. HMo09..0pl4jub(FZf=~$ABP(XLP They were produced by Gregorelli and Uberti. The proof house marks and manufacturing code are stamped elsewhere on the gun. the one I have is in the 2,000 serial range. Italian proof mark is rather straight forward, normally one . The barrel pictured is a perfect example as it bears all of the Italian proof 0000051711 00000 n We cant knock the rifle for that, however, because it all looked clean and crisp with those sharp edges. 0000007663 00000 n A little wear from use will fix that, or these could be deburred carefully by the owner. 0000003080 00000 n The Italian proof marks should have a rectangular or square box with a date code in it. Minimal tooling marks on inside of brass. Not consenting or withdrawing consent, may adversely affect certain features and functions. In the early days of the Navy Arms / Uberti connection, Gregorelli actually produced the metal parts for the revolvers and Uberti assembled them. OCT. 16. Wayne, you do not say whether or not these pistols are held on a firearms certificate. Stock Configuration & Condition/ Grip:The stocks are two-piece smooth wood featuring a forend and pistol grip. According to a web site this is the Italian date code for 1977. Simi Valley, CA 93065. 0000010481 00000 n Behind that were two Italian proof marks. I have a 1858 remington new army revolver I purchased at a garage sale. ", http://www.oldwestguns.ca/index.php?cts&object=175, http://s89.photobucket.com/albums/k228/4fingermick/, http://www.powderhombre.com/mbpproofmarks.pdf, Vintage Boxes - Gear, Shell, Case, Primer, Group Buys Design, Active , Waiting and Archives, Closed Buys/Waiting for delivery/in shipment, If this is your first visit, be sure to The above manufacturers turn out tens of thousands of firearms each year and most, if not all, of these weapons are copies of those used and made in nineteenth century America. Length of pull - 13 1/8" (to center of buttplate) Approx. "I'll help you down the trail and proud to!" 4. Derek Landers, I have one single shot black powder handgun, percussion, brass frame steel barrel. black powder side by side deringer And it has no markings, How can a guy find out who makes it?? Johnnie Roper,Alias:Gunslinger9378. 79 0 obj <>stream I find strange that an Uberti gun has no date code. 1) An example of a full set of Proof and makers marks on a Pedersoli pistol. To my amazement, I found another Uberti/Colt .22 single action at Collector Firearms' web site . The reason for the missing letters in the sequence is unknown. Because the availability of 44-40 ammunition choices is fairly tight (MidwayUSA.com lists 10 choices, with only lead bullets, in weights from 200 to 225 grains), we figured if we found an 1860 we liked, wed prefer to have a wider range of loads for it, so we acquired one chambered in 45 Colt (aka Long Colt), for which MidwayUSA.com lists 56 results, in bullet weights from 145 grains to 360 grains in lead, copper, even shotshells. If you take the grips off there could be a mark on the brass underneath. 0000036933 00000 n It was not rust bluing, but looked close enough to it to satisfy us. This gun has no Italian proof marks and is not marked blackpowder only. Wed buy this one instantly if we wanted a brass gun for fun. A copy of a letter dated June 6, 1988 on the Aldo Uberti & Co. letterhead to Kevin Cherry (Cherrys, 2703 High Point Rd., Greensboro, NC 27403) showing the model (all are single action rev.), barrel length (4 , 5 , 7 and 10 inches) and caliber (.44 Mag., .22Conv., .22 LR and .22 CAL), and serial numbers of 65 revolvers. February 18, 2016 in SASS Wire. Just wondering what firm F.A.R.A was/is? 14) A strange mark often found on Italian black powder arms! We found the barrel flats to be properly done. 0000105108 00000 n Save my name, email, and website in this browser for the next time I comment. Rooster Cogburn. You could always ask Val Forgett at Navy Arms,Here is his facebook page where you can contact him, https://www.facebook.com/Navy-Arms-Firearms-326497049152/?fref=ts. When you purchase through links on our site, we may earn an affiliate commission, which supports our community. A. UBERTI & C. GARDONE V.T. "The democracy will cease to exist when you take away from those who are willing to work and give to those who would not" - Thomas Jefferson. Metal to metal fit very precise, ditto for wood grips to back strap. http://www.powderhombre.com/mbpproofmarks.pdf You must have Adobe or similar software to read pdf files. My first thoughts are that they may be Section 1 firearms so I would recommend that you go to a local firearms dealer and ask his advice if you do not have them on FAC. I still adore my Uberti but my Henry Original is hands down the superior rifle of the two reproductions. 0000080946 00000 n In short, put the lever anywhere you want it during the loading process, and it will still take a full cycle of the lever to get the first round into the chamber. I have .36 caliber 1851 navy model with the markings, black powder only made in Italy on the barrel and the 3 standardized proof house marks on the other side but I dont see any of the Italian makers marks, except for a name of HUBERTUS in a rectangular box. These are the guns that REALLY, "Won The West!" The front sight was also identical in contour to the other rifle, and had a flat-topped blade insert of somewhat shiny metal. Another well known name here in the UK is that of Pietta, and their logo is a diamond containing the letters FAP often accompanied by the name F.LLI PIETTA. The main difference between Taylor's and Cimirron will be the Importer's Marks. Perfect timing. If you don't Facebook PM me the details of the rifle and I'll make sure he gets it. 0000038657 00000 n Loading the rifle was easy, by which we mean the follower easily raised the front lock to let the gate swing open without any of the fiddling the Henrys version needed. The gun is beautifully finished and it remains mechanically sound. Finally, as a collector of antique weapons, I have to say that I would not like these marks to be omitted entirely. Their health and their love.I love The people I have gotten to meet in sass and the ones that have just talked to on the wire.I do like to shoot and pick on people at the shoot.I love the hugs I get and the ones I will get when I meet some on you people. Pre 60s? Remingtons New Model Army revolver is also a favourite and we have seen single and double action Starr pistols and lately a Whitney Navy revolver. was founded in 1959 and has always used a capital U sur-rounded by an octagonal device, which is actually the muzzle of an 1851 Navy . 0000001791 00000 n 94 W. Cochran St., Suite B The Rifle models have similar cosmetics to the Trapper but have 24.5-inch barrels, one chambered in 44-40 (342390) and our test gun in 45 Colt. Eho is the manufacturer ? Mechanics:The action functions correctly. The right side of the chamber is marked CAL. It was sold through Beeman's catalog in 1984. A copy of a telex communication dated September 9, 1986 from Colt Firearms to Aldo Uberti & Co. ordering 65 firearms (five Phanton .44 Mag and 60 SA firearms in .22 and .44 Mag in 4 , 5 and 7 inch barrel lengths). Another Brescia based company, Armi Sport, marks their guns with AC within a circle. Also included is the origianal cardboard wood grain box and waxed wrapping paper. I have a black powder 6 shot revolver with no serial numbers, proof marks or name of manufacturer or importer. 0000012277 00000 n %%EOF M) endstream endobj 38 0 obj 702 endobj 39 0 obj << /Type /FontDescriptor /Ascent 935 /CapHeight 0 /Descent -211 /Flags 4 /FontBBox [ -182 -307 1000 1086 ] /FontName /EIOFKH+ArialNarrow /ItalicAngle 0 /StemV 0 /FontFile2 41 0 R >> endobj 40 0 obj << /Type /Font /Subtype /TrueType /FirstChar 32 /LastChar 146 /Widths [ 228 0 0 0 0 0 547 157 273 273 0 0 228 273 228 228 456 456 456 456 456 456 456 456 456 456 228 228 0 0 0 456 0 547 547 592 592 547 501 638 592 228 410 547 456 683 592 638 547 0 592 547 501 592 547 774 547 547 501 228 0 228 0 0 0 456 456 410 456 456 228 456 456 182 182 410 182 683 456 456 456 456 273 410 228 456 410 592 410 410 410 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 182 ] /BaseFont /EIOFKH+ArialNarrow /FontDescriptor 39 0 R >> endobj 41 0 obj << /Filter /FlateDecode /Length 19412 /Length1 28000 >> stream There have been few days since my arrival here in late 1977, that I have not carried a gun, either on my hip, or beneath my left armpit. We believe the original Henry rifles (from the 19th century) had blued parts, but there were some finish variations in the 1866 and 1873 rifles that followed it, so we believe its possible some of the original Henrys had case-hardened parts. 2405 PrOOF mark CirCa PrOOF hOuse tYPe OF PrOOF and gun since 1856 Birmingham provisional proof for barrels since 1637 London definitive black powder proof for shotguns,muzzle loader barrels 1811-1892 Liege black powder proof for rifles 1897-1923 Liege black powder proof for rifles To view prices realized you must be an "Archives Member". My heart bleeds for you gun lovers in the U.K. 0000050889 00000 n While the stock finish was mighty hard, it had none of the milkiness that Henrys rifle had. While the action was not quite so glossy as the Henry version, it still reflected much like a mirror and was, like the barrel flats, dead flat. #6. Any British "Would be Pistoleeero's are welcome to contact me at my e-mail address: . To our knowledge that problem does not exist with the 44-40 version, so if you opt for this caliber, use some sense in choosing your ammunition. Does it have proof marks? Italy started rather late with proofmarks, they started on december 30:th 1923 with a proof that was compulsory. Be sure to match the rifles caliber to that of your handguns as you ride off into the sunset to your next shooting match, just as they did in the Old West. Pietta always has the proofmarks and the datecode on the right side of the frame. 0000003341 00000 n Dear Friends, These revolvers are extremely collectible. Thank you. 22 HORNET. 0000080318 00000 n 10) Uberti name and address stamping from 1975. All the controls worked smoothly, and our range session was most pleasant. It is in the 2,000 serial range and has GU mark. But when you close the lever to the firing position, that round is not brought up into battery. The proof marks are described in Table 2. The proof house marks and manufacturing code are stamped elsewhere on the gun. trailer << /Size 67 /Info 20 0 R /Root 23 0 R /Prev 117549 /ID[<3013820267cc20c18f38ceb2ef54c0c3>] >> startxref 0 %%EOF 23 0 obj << /Type /Catalog /Pages 19 0 R /Metadata 21 0 R /AcroForm 24 0 R >> endobj 24 0 obj << /Fields [ ] /DR << /Font << /ZaDb 16 0 R /Helv 17 0 R >> /Encoding << /PDFDocEncoding 18 0 R >> >> /DA (/Helv 0 Tf 0 g ) >> endobj 65 0 obj << /S 98 /V 209 /Filter /FlateDecode /Length 66 0 R >> stream To provide the best experiences, we use technologies like cookies to store and/or access device information. We'll start about there. To become a member $3 for one day $7 one month or $15 one year, One-of-a-Kinds ~ Antique and Collectibles, Metal Shank Buttons with Victorian Design. xref Likewise, many of the Winchester or Sharps rifle clones will have been manufactured in the same area. 5) The palm tree logo of Palmetto Arms. The first proof mark, which appears on all weapons produced in Italy since 1950, is a star within a wavy edged circle (I have seen this described as lands and grooves of rifling) above a crest in a shield. HV{PTwjrh"1 fv] The right side of the chamber is marked "CAL. UBERTI & C. GARDONE V.T. From these humble beginnings has grown an industry catering for the needs of shooters, re-enactors and collectors Worldwide. ix)]'Aa-;O;KGg 6+Rg^vF$^og>XxZaNz:E Remingtons bullet had a slight shoulder, which was part of the problem. 22 0 obj << /Linearized 1 /O 25 /H [ 1485 306 ] /L 118117 /E 82195 /N 2 /T 117559 >> endobj xref 22 45 0000000016 00000 n We tested mainly with PMC cowboy-type ammo, which is a mild load with a hard lead bullet. Happy New Year! Most members even possess Colt Percussion Clones, by Uberti & Pietta.. Frascarelli. This includes not only information about their purchase and use, but also the promotion of firearm safety and training. The recently introduced line of firearms from Palmetto Arms is marked with the company logo of a palm tree within a circle, sometimes followed by the name, PALMETTO.
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